Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

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Adur Alkain
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Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Adur Alkain »

I have just finished a long essay outlining my own personal formulation of idealism, which is largely inspired in Bernardo's Analytic Idealism but differs from it in some key points. I hope some of you might find it interesting.

Since the essay is so long, I'm posting only it's first two parts: The first (this one) raises some objections against Bernardo's system. The second part offers an alternative, more intuitive formulation of idealism. I would greatly appreciate any comments, corrections and/or suggestions!



Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (I)
A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation of idealism


Bernardo Kastrup is, in my humble opinion, the most relevant philosopher of our time. His diagnosis of materialism, or reductionist physicalism, as the ultimate cause of the existential crisis our civilization is facing right now, and his advancing of idealism as the only viable alternative are, I believe, spot on. However, it is my view that Analytic Idealism, the particular formulation of idealism that Bernardo Kastrup is proposing, has some subtle but serious flaws that will prevent it from dethroning materialism and becoming the new dominant philosophy in our culture.

The purpose of this essay is to point out those flaws, and to delineate an alternative formulation of idealism which I believe has a better chance at transforming the mainstream worldview of our culture. To distinguish it from Bernardo’s version of idealism, I have provisionally called this alternative view “Intuitive Idealism”, because it uses intuition, rather than logic or reasoning, as its main guiding force. As a result, it presents a more intuitive view of reality than any other version of idealism I’m aware of.


Our intuitions about the world

We all feel that the world around us is real. It doesn’t matter if we are physicalists or idealists. When we see a rock, we feel it is a real rock. We feel it exists independently of our conscious perception of it.

This isn’t the result of cultural indoctrination. In all known cultures, even those where non-dual philosophies and world-denying religions are prevalent, unschooled human beings take the world they inhabit as absolutely real. It is a universal intuition. That’s why this view is often called “naive realism”.

A cognitive psychologist like Donald Hoffman would probably explain the universality of this basic intuition about the world as the result of natural selection. For the purpose of survival, it is an obvious evolutionary advantage to take the world seriously, even literally.

I don’t agree with that explanation, though. In an idealistic paradigm, any argument from natural selection is problematic (I will come back to this point later). And in this particular case, if we don’t assume (like physicalists do) that our ideas about the world are mechanically produced by our brains, it’s not clear how natural selection could have any influence on those ideas.

In the view I’m presenting here, intuition is a fundamental faculty of consciousness that enables us to get direct access to (or at least, glimpses of) objective truth.

In other words, according to Intuitive Idealism our basic intuition about the world is correct: the physical world is real, and it exists objectively, no matter if we are looking at it or not.

This universal intuition that all humans share about a real, objective world that we all perceive but that exists independently of our perceptions is the main reason behind the supremacy of modern materialism/physicalism.

However, there is another basic, universal intuition about the world that modern physicalists have chosen to ignore. When we look at the world, when we gaze at the sea, at a mountainous landscape, at a starry night sky, we don’t see a dead, cold universe. We feel that the universe is alive. And that it is, somehow, conscious.

Our ancestors shared this intuition, and expressed it in innumerable myths. Modern physicalists dismiss those myths as childish fantasies in which the human mind projects its own consciousness onto a lifeless, meaningless universe. But the basic intuition of a conscious universe persists (even though many people, conditioned by religious beliefs, interpret it as the presence of God’s spirit in all of creation, or something along those lines), and has prevented the total dominion of the materialist paradigm over contemporary culture.

We thus have two basic intuitions about the nature of the universe: that the world we perceive has objective existence, independent of our perceptions, and that it is imbued with consciousness. Physicalism accepts the first and denies the second. Analytic Idealism does the opposite. Intuitive Idealism embraces both.


A rose is a rose


Donald Hoffman has recently popularized the notion of the physical world as a simplified, species-specific user interface, evolved through natural selection, that doesn’t match the underlying objective reality, to which we have no direct access. Bernardo Kastrup endorses this view, preferring to use the equivalent metaphor of the physical world as a “dashboard of dials”.

This counter-intuitive notion is no doubt suggestive and ingenious, but it is based on a false premise. The mathematical theorem developed by Hoffman and his team, if correct (I’m assuming it is, since I’m not qualified to assess it), proves that physicalism is false. That’s it. It can’t be used to extract any other conclusions about the nature of reality.

Hoffman’s theorem is based on the theory of evolution by natural selection (which is part of the physicalist paradigm). But if, as Hoffman suggests, space-time is not fundamental, evolution by natural selection can’t be fundamental either. It may be mathematically provable that natural selection would evolve simplified, species-specific user interfaces to deal with the objective environment. But without fundamental time, the very notion of evolution loses all explanatory power regarding fundamental reality (it can only explain developments within relative space-time). And without fundamental space, there is no environment to begin with.

This last statement is a crucial one. The user interface (or dashboard) model relies on the existence of an objective environment, a fundamental reality that is “out there”, outside our perceptions. According to Intuitive Idealism, there is no such thing. There is no absolute space containing the relative space-time in which our perceptions appear. There is no environment.

The physical world is appearance. Not the “outer appearance” of something else. Just appearance. Appearing is being. The physical world is purely phenomenal.

In Intuitive Idealism there is no duality, no separation between noumena and phenomena. This is why a more precise name for this metaphysical view would be Nondual Idealism. I chose not to use it in this essay, though, because Analytic Idealism is also, at least in principle, a non-dualistic ontology. (It can be argued, of course, that Bernardo Kastrup introduces a sort of dualism with his distinction between “intrinsic view” and “extrinsic appearance”, but I don’t want to argue around terminology here.)

In other words, according to Intuitive Idealism a rock is a rock, a tree is a tree, a star is a star. The physical world is exactly what it appears to be. Nothing more, nothing less. A rose is a rose.


Conscious experience has no extrinsic appearance

Bernardo Kastrup’s entire philosophical system (Analytic Idealism) is based on the idea that physical reality is the extrinsic appearance of inner experience. This is certainly an original and clever idea, but it’s also completely counter-intuitive. Not only that. It is difficult (maybe impossible) to get a clear mental picture of what it means.

Do conscious experiences have an extrinsic appearance? The immediate intuition is that they don’t. The very notion seems preposterous. How could something as private, as personally untransferable as our conscious experiences be witnessed in any way from a third-person perspective? Can we look from outside at a thought, an emotion, a sense perception? The intuitive answer is that we definitely can’t. When it comes to conscious experience, there is only a first-person perspective.

The notion of extrinsic or outer appearance relies on the dualist separation between subject and object. For something to have an extrinsic appearance, we have to conceptualize it as an object that can be observed from the outside by a separate subject. But conscious experiences aren’t objects. There is no subject-object separation in consciousness. The observer is the observed. Consciousness can’t be observed from the outside, because there is nothing outside consciousness.


Consciousness has no boundaries

Bernardo Kastrup knows all this perfectly well, of course. When he uses the expression “extrinsic or outer appearance of inner experience”, he doesn’t mean “from outside the experience”, but “from outside the dissociative boundary”. This is actually the cornerstone on which the whole edifice of Analytic Idealism rests: the notion of dissociative boundaries separating our individual consciousness from universal consciousness and from other instances of individual consciousness (I use the expression “instances of individual consciousness” to avoid the misleading plural “consciousnesses”; there is only one consciousness).

We are on uncharted territory here. As far as I know, this is a completely novel and original idea, completely detached from any basic intuitions we may have about the nature of consciousness. Bernardo sometimes uses the metaphor of whirlpools on a stream to help us visualize these dissociative boundaries in consciousness. The dissociative boundary encircling an instance of individual consciousness is akin to the rim of a particular whirlpool.

However, the metaphor doesn’t really work, because whirlpools don’t have rims. There is no boundary, no dividing line separating a whirlpool from the rest of the stream. This is probably the reason why Bernardo seems to have abandoned the metaphor (he certainly doesn’t use it in his academic writings).

According to Analytic Idealism, our physical bodies are the extrinsic appearance of dissociative boundaries inside universal consciousness. Well, we can certainly visualize physical bodies. But in what meaningful way could these be the outer appearance of something we can hardly conceive?

Since there is only consciousness and nothing but consciousness (as idealists, we can all agree on this), these dissociative boundaries must also consist of consciousness (that was the whole point of the whirlpool metaphor: there is nothing to whirlpools but water). How can this be? How can something absolutely boundless and limitless like consciousness create any kind of limiting boundaries within itself? The intuitive answer to this question is straightforward: it can’t.


Universal consciousness has no mental disorder

I’m not denying the existence of dissociation. What I’m denying is the existence of dissociative boundaries. Dissociation doesn’t entail the existence of a boundary limiting the access of consciousness to certain contents. Dissociation is just a shift in attention. To a dissociated mind, like for example a person who has defensively suppressed memories of childhood trauma, it may seem that there’s an impenetrable barrier barring access to those painful memories, but there is no actual barrier: the mind is simply refusing to go there.

It’s an obvious fact that we don’t habitually have direct access to the experience of universal consciousness. Our individual consciousness is (for most of us, and for most of the time) dissociated from universal consciousness. But this isn’t caused by any sort of barrier or boundary. Our attention is simply elsewhere. We are completely absorbed in the content of our everyday life experiences. This absorption, this fixation of our attention in the experiences of our individual, apparently limited self, is what prevents us from experiencing universal consciousness in its limitless fullness.

Bernardo Kastrup sometimes refers to this phenomenon with the term “obfuscation”. He uses the metaphor of the stronger light of the Sun obfuscating the stars and rendering them invisible to us during the day, although they are still there. The problem with this metaphor is that it is physically impossible for us to see the stars during daylight. But it is never impossible for us to experience universal consciousness. In fact, we are experiencing it all the time. We simply are not paying attention.

A better metaphor (since the light of universal consciousness is infinitely stronger than that of our individual consciousness, and is its source) would be to say that if we look directly at the Sun, it’s blinding light will prevent us from seeing anything else. Therefore, in order to be able to see the ground under our feet, the trees, the mountains, the sea, the sky, the world around us, we actively avoid looking directly at the Sun. But it’s the light of the Sun what enables us to see all those things. This averting of our eyes is akin to the averting of our attention, the dissociation that, as we go about our everyday life, prevents us from directly experiencing universal consciousness.

Consciousness can never get obfuscated. Nothing can limit it in any way. In other words, universal consciousness doesn’t suffer from “dissociative identity disorder” (DID). If we want to use psychiatric analogies, it would be much more appropriate to use the notion of narcissism.


Narcissism as a natural development in consciousness

Narcissism is usually defined as pathological self-absorption. Psychiatrists diagnose severe cases of narcissistic disturbance as “narcissistic personality disorder” (NPD). But narcissism can also be understood in a broader sense, as a universal condition of all unenlightened human beings. Everybody who has an ego has some form of narcissism.

A. H. Almaas defines narcissism as “the condition that results when the self identifies with any content of experience to the exclusion of awareness of its fundamental Being” (Almaas, A. H. The Point of Existence. Transformation of Narcissism in Self-Realization, Shambhala, 1996, p. 36). This is the condition most of us find ourselves in, most of the time.

We all remember the old myth of Narcissus, the young man who fell in love with his own reflection in a pool of water. He spent the rest of his life staring at it, forgetting everything else. Analogously, our individual consciousness identifies and becomes absorbed with a mental image of itself, a mental construct based on past impressions and acquired beliefs (ego identity), forgetting its fundamental Being, which is Consciousness. This is what Almaas calls “narcissism of everyday life”.

This universal narcissism is the sole explanation for our dissociation from universal consciousness. It’s a matter of misplaced attention, caused by a false identity, an illusion of self-reflection. For millennia, wisdom traditions of East and West have applied all kinds of practices (such as different forms of meditation, yoga, ritualized use of psychedelics, philosophical inquiry, experiential introspection, etc.) to liberate humans from this false ego identity, this absorption in an illusory mental reflection, and bring them back to the full realization of their true identity: pure consciousness or Being. In its origins, Western philosophy was one of these wisdom traditions. Only in modern times does it seem to have lost its way.

Most Eastern traditions see ego identity as an unjustified and regrettable error, the direct cause of all human suffering. Following Almaas, I prefer to view it as a necessary phase in the development and evolution of consciousness. This is consistent with Western spiritual traditions, like Sufism, that value the human soul (individual consciousness) as an indispensable conduit for Being (universal consciousness) in its never-ending movement towards self-knowledge and self-realization.

In short, there is nothing wrong or pathological in our present situation. All is well with universal consciousness. Our dissociation from it is just a temporary and necessary phase in its unstoppable evolution.
Physicalists hold two fundamental beliefs:

1. The essence of Nature is Mathematics.
2. Consciousness is a product of the human brain.

But the two contraries are true:

1. The essence of Nature is Consciousness.
2. Mathematics is a product of the human brain.
ScottRoberts
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by ScottRoberts »

Adur Alkain wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 9:50 am
However, there is another basic, universal intuition about the world that modern physicalists have chosen to ignore. When we look at the world, when we gaze at the sea, at a mountainous landscape, at a starry night sky, we don’t see a dead, cold universe. We feel that the universe is alive. And that it is, somehow, conscious.
I don't have this intuition. I observe a cat, and I intuit it is conscious. I observe a tree and intuit that it is alive but not that it is conscious. I observer a rock and intuit neither aliveness nor consciousness.
Our ancestors shared this intuition, and expressed it in innumerable myths.
We don't share this intuition. They had it, we don't. (See my Idealism vs. Common Sense essay for more on this.)
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Eugene I
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Eugene I »

Adur Alkain wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 9:50 am It’s an obvious fact that we don’t habitually have direct access to the experience of universal consciousness. Our individual consciousness is (for most of us, and for most of the time) dissociated from universal consciousness. But this isn’t caused by any sort of barrier or boundary. Our attention is simply elsewhere. We are completely absorbed in the content of our everyday life experiences. This absorption, this fixation of our attention in the experiences of our individual, apparently limited self, is what prevents us from experiencing universal consciousness in its limitless fullness.

Bernardo Kastrup sometimes refers to this phenomenon with the term “obfuscation”. He uses the metaphor of the stronger light of the Sun obfuscating the stars and rendering them invisible to us during the day, although they are still there. The problem with this metaphor is that it is physically impossible for us to see the stars during daylight. But it is never impossible for us to experience universal consciousness. In fact, we are experiencing it all the time. We simply are not paying attention.

A better metaphor (since the light of universal consciousness is infinitely stronger than that of our individual consciousness, and is its source) would be to say that if we look directly at the Sun, it’s blinding light will prevent us from seeing anything else. Therefore, in order to be able to see the ground under our feet, the trees, the mountains, the sea, the sky, the world around us, we actively avoid looking directly at the Sun. But it’s the light of the Sun what enables us to see all those things. This averting of our eyes is akin to the averting of our attention, the dissociation that, as we go about our everyday life, prevents us from directly experiencing universal consciousness.
I agree that "boundaries" is a poor term for the seeming disconnect between our personal and universal experiences. However, I don't think it is as easy as just a focus of attention.

Let's try an experiment. I assume you are an experienced spiritual practitioner and was able to master the attention of your individual consciousness and access the experiences beyond your individual and limited "field" of attention. If this is the case then you should be able to experience any conscious experience of other people at any time just by focusing your attention. Can you tell me what is my experience right now? I am pretty sure you can't (but please tell me if I'm wrong), which means that there is something else going on here other than just focus of your attention. I'm afraid your explanation is too simplistic.
"Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kanzas anymore" Dorothy
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Adur Alkain
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Adur Alkain »

ScottRoberts wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 11:42 pm
Adur Alkain wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 9:50 am
However, there is another basic, universal intuition about the world that modern physicalists have chosen to ignore. When we look at the world, when we gaze at the sea, at a mountainous landscape, at a starry night sky, we don’t see a dead, cold universe. We feel that the universe is alive. And that it is, somehow, conscious.
I don't have this intuition. I observe a cat, and I intuit it is conscious. I observe a tree and intuit that it is alive but not that it is conscious. I observer a rock and intuit neither aliveness nor consciousness.
Our ancestors shared this intuition, and expressed it in innumerable myths.
We don't share this intuition. They had it, we don't. (See my Idealism vs. Common Sense essay for more on this.)
Thanks for your comment, Scott!

I re-read your article (I had already read it when Bernardo published it in his website; I think it's very good, btw) and I see what you mean . But what I call "intuition" is not the same as the "common sense" you are talking about. By intuition I mean a direct knowing that resides in pure consciousness. It is timeless and universal. We all have it, since in essence we all are nothing but universal consciousness, but it gets obscured and distorted by our conditioning, our ordinary thinking, education, culture, etc. Small children are more in touch with that intuition than adults. For example, most children paint the sun with a smily face. You could link that to what Owen Barfield calls "original participation", I guess.

I quite like Owen Barfield's ideas, but I disagree on some points. For example, when he says "we", he means "modern Western educated people", or something like that. I think you are using the same "we". But I don't identify with that "we". I'm Basque, and in our country when we look at our mountains we see our Mother. It has always been like that for us. It is changing now, of course, with the influence of modern media, but I don't believe this is an irreversible process, some kind of unstoppable progress of humanity, like Barfield seemed to think.

It doesn't matter. I wasn't talking about human culture, but about basic intuition, which hasn't changed and will never change. And yes, I believe this universal intuition tells us that the universe we see is alive and conscious.

For example, I remember watching Carl Sagan's Cosmos when I was a kid. He would often talk about the sense of "awe" we feel when we look at the starry sky. I always wondered why he would feel such awe, since nothing he talked about seemed awe-inspiring to me. He would wax lyrical about "billions and billions of galaxies", "billions and billions of years", or light years, or whatever. I guess that, being a mathematically oriented atheist, large numbers was the only resort he had to try to explain his sense of reverence (I believe he wasn't faking it) while witnessing "the vastness of the universe". Since numbers never meant much to me, all those billions and trillions of whatever always left me cold. But I never needed numbers. I was sort of a pantheist as a kid.

Anyway. I'm not sure that example works. But I still think that we all have, even if it's buried deep under all kinds of cultural or personal conditioning, the intuition that the universe is not a dead, cold place.

Of course, I don't claim that my "intuitive" version of idealism is totally based on that kind of real intuition. I'm just trying to get as close to that basic knowledge, that direct knowing of reality (like what we experience as children, or on psychedelic trips) as I can. My own education and conditioning and preconceived ideas get in the way all the time, I'm sure.
Physicalists hold two fundamental beliefs:

1. The essence of Nature is Mathematics.
2. Consciousness is a product of the human brain.

But the two contraries are true:

1. The essence of Nature is Consciousness.
2. Mathematics is a product of the human brain.
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Adur Alkain
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Adur Alkain »

Eugene I wrote: Fri Aug 20, 2021 7:20 pm
Adur Alkain wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 9:50 am It’s an obvious fact that we don’t habitually have direct access to the experience of universal consciousness. Our individual consciousness is (for most of us, and for most of the time) dissociated from universal consciousness. But this isn’t caused by any sort of barrier or boundary. Our attention is simply elsewhere. We are completely absorbed in the content of our everyday life experiences. This absorption, this fixation of our attention in the experiences of our individual, apparently limited self, is what prevents us from experiencing universal consciousness in its limitless fullness.

Bernardo Kastrup sometimes refers to this phenomenon with the term “obfuscation”. He uses the metaphor of the stronger light of the Sun obfuscating the stars and rendering them invisible to us during the day, although they are still there. The problem with this metaphor is that it is physically impossible for us to see the stars during daylight. But it is never impossible for us to experience universal consciousness. In fact, we are experiencing it all the time. We simply are not paying attention.

A better metaphor (since the light of universal consciousness is infinitely stronger than that of our individual consciousness, and is its source) would be to say that if we look directly at the Sun, it’s blinding light will prevent us from seeing anything else. Therefore, in order to be able to see the ground under our feet, the trees, the mountains, the sea, the sky, the world around us, we actively avoid looking directly at the Sun. But it’s the light of the Sun what enables us to see all those things. This averting of our eyes is akin to the averting of our attention, the dissociation that, as we go about our everyday life, prevents us from directly experiencing universal consciousness.
I agree that "boundaries" is a poor term for the seeming disconnect between our personal and universal experiences. However, I don't think it is as easy as just a focus of attention.

Let's try an experiment. I assume you are an experienced spiritual practitioner and was able to master the attention of your individual consciousness and access the experiences beyond your individual and limited "field" of attention. If this is the case then you should be able to experience any conscious experience of other people at any time just by focusing your attention. Can you tell me what is my experience right now? I am pretty sure you can't (but please tell me if I'm wrong), which means that there is something else going on here other than just focus of your attention. I'm afraid your explanation is too simplistic.
Hi Eugene, thanks for the comment!

In my view, we are not our egos, and we are not "alters of mind-at-large". We are universal consciousness. That's what we are, and that's all there is. So, insofar as I am universal consciousness, the answer is yes, I am able to experience the conscious experiences of any living organism in the universe, just by focusing my attention.

But insofar as my attention is right now focused on Adur's experience (I need to do that in order to write this reply), at this moment I can't access Eugene's or anybody else's experience. This is what dissociation means.

Instead of talking about a "focus of attention", maybe it would be clearer to see it as "localization in space-time". Universal consciousness is nonlocal. It is simultaneously experiencing the experiences of all living organisms at all points in space-time. But living organisms are localized in particular points of space-time. Eugene is at point A, Adur is at point B. So Adur has no access to Eugene's inner experiences. Universal consciousness does.

In my essay I talked about "attention", however, because it's possible, at any particular location, to shift our (universal consciousness's) attention from the particular inner experiences of Eugene or Adur to the direct experience of boundless universal consciousness. This is the end of dissociation, and it's what all spiritual teachings and practices try to achieve. Universal narcissism is what prevents most of us from reaching that awakening.

But for those fortunate few who wake up from the dissociation (this is universal consciousness waking up at a particular location), it becomes possible, in principle, to access the experience of any living being (there are many well-documented stories of enlightened teachers being able to "read" their students' thoughts). However, the experience usually stays at the level of oceanic, pure boundless consciousness. Individual life situations tend to seem irrelevant from that vantage point.

The point is, there is no boundary preventing me (universal consciousness experiencing the world at Adur's particular location) from accessing your (Eugene's) inner experience. It's only the narcissistic focus of my attention on Adur's particular experiences (which absorb all my attention right now) that prevents me from doing so.

You may still think this explanation is too simplistic. But this narcissistic focus of attention is based on ego structures. And ego structures are far from simple. They are the result of a long process (starting in early childhood) of becoming identified with certain emotions, beliefs, perceptions, ideas about the world and about ourselves. These structures mold and constrain most of our adult experience. It takes a life-long endeavour of working through those ego structures to liberate ourselves and wake up from the dissociation.
Physicalists hold two fundamental beliefs:

1. The essence of Nature is Mathematics.
2. Consciousness is a product of the human brain.

But the two contraries are true:

1. The essence of Nature is Consciousness.
2. Mathematics is a product of the human brain.
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Eugene I
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Eugene I »

Adur Alkain wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 7:28 am You may still think this explanation is too simplistic. But this narcissistic focus of attention is based on ego structures. And ego structures are far from simple. They are the result of a long process (starting in early childhood) of becoming identified with certain emotions, beliefs, perceptions, ideas about the world and about ourselves. These structures mold and constrain most of our adult experience. It takes a life-long endeavour of working through those ego structures to liberate ourselves and wake up from the dissociation.
I still have two objections:
- You criticize the BK's DID model, but instead present an alternative explanation referring to a no-less problematic psychiatric condition - narcistic personality disorder. Either way, DID or narcistic - it's a disorder, a pathology. I don't think it is fair to characterize the majority of people as narcistic, some of them are, but by far not all.
- There are many examples of people (such as masters of spiritual traditions) who were able to transcend their ego structures. Yet there is no evidence that as the result they were able to remove their dissociative disconnect and directly access and experience the conscious states of other beings. So it is clearly not just the ego structures and narcissism that is responsible for the lack of such assess.
"Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kanzas anymore" Dorothy
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Adur Alkain
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

Post by Adur Alkain »

Eugene I wrote: Sun Aug 22, 2021 9:36 am
Adur Alkain wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 7:28 am You may still think this explanation is too simplistic. But this narcissistic focus of attention is based on ego structures. And ego structures are far from simple. They are the result of a long process (starting in early childhood) of becoming identified with certain emotions, beliefs, perceptions, ideas about the world and about ourselves. These structures mold and constrain most of our adult experience. It takes a life-long endeavour of working through those ego structures to liberate ourselves and wake up from the dissociation.
I still have two objections:
- You criticize the BK's DID model, but instead present an alternative explanation referring to a no-less problematic psychiatric condition - narcistic personality disorder. Either way, DID or narcistic - it's a disorder, a pathology. I don't think it is fair to characterize the majority of people as narcistic, some of them are, but by far not all.
- There are many examples of people (such as masters of spiritual traditions) who were able to transcend their ego structures. Yet there is no evidence that as the result they were able to remove their dissociative disconnect and directly access and experience the conscious states of other beings. So it is clearly not just the ego structures and narcissism that is responsible for the lack of such assess.
Hi Eugene,

Sorry for taking so long to respond.

- What Almaas calls "narcissism of everyday life" or universal narcissism is not a mental disorder. It's simply another name for ego identity. Everybody who has an ego has this "universal narcissism". It is not the same as the "narcissistic personality disorder" (NPD) psychiatrists talk about. If you don't like to call it "narcissism", call it ego identity. It's still, in my view, a better explanation for most people's disconnection from the direct experience of universal consciousness than Bernardo's DID model.

- You say there is no evidence that enlightened teachers are in some way capable of accessing the conscious states of other beings. On the contrary, I think there is plenty of anecdotal evidence of exactly this sort of occurrence. You can find many stories of students experiencing their teachers or gurus apparently "reading their minds".

You may find this anecdotal evidence not convincing enough. And I'm sure that there are many enlightened teachers who don't have this capacity. Still, there can be all kinds of reasons why some teachers don't read their students' minds, or are able to see the world from the perspective of an eagle flying over their heads, like some teachers report doing. Maybe some teachers are simply not interested in that sort of thing. The point is, one single instance of this phenomenon ("mind reading", or whatever) would be enough to give credence to my theory.

Ego has many layers. One can be free of some ego structures and still be bound by some deeper, more subtle layers of ego. This is true for many enlightened teachers. They are relatively free from ego and thus can help their students, but still have some unconscious ego structures in them.

In my essay I spoke only about ego identity, but there is a different kind of ego structures, which in some spiritual teachings are called "ego boundaries". These ego boundaries are often deeper and stronger than ego identity. They are deeper in the sense that they are developed earlier in life than ego identity. So some people (spiritual teachers, for example) can be free from ego identity, and experience themselves as one with universal consciousness, and still be limited by the ego boundary of their physical bodies. They still hold the unconscious belief that they are bounded by their physical bodies. This unconscious ego boundary will make it impossible for them to access the conscious inner life of other beings around them.

These ego boundaries are actually an unconscious defense mechanism against the experience of merging. It is well known in deep psychology that newborn babies can experience themselves as completely merged with their mothers. They have direct access to their mothers' conscious states: especially emotions, since at that age babies have no way of processing complex thoughts. But at some point the human infant learns to separate itself from mother, by developing these ego boundaries.

Maybe I should rewrite my essay to introduce this notion of ego boundaries, since it provides a broader perspective and a more complete explanation than the notion of narcissism, which pertains exclusively to ego identity.

Thank you for your critique, it helped me realize that this piece was missing!
Physicalists hold two fundamental beliefs:

1. The essence of Nature is Mathematics.
2. Consciousness is a product of the human brain.

But the two contraries are true:

1. The essence of Nature is Consciousness.
2. Mathematics is a product of the human brain.
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AshvinP
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Re: Intuitive Idealism vs. Analytic Idealism (Part I): A critique of Bernardo Kastrup’s formulation

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Adur Alkain wrote: Thu Sep 09, 2021 7:49 pm These ego boundaries are actually an unconscious defense mechanism against the experience of merging. It is well known in deep psychology that newborn babies can experience themselves as completely merged with their mothers. They have direct access to their mothers' conscious states: especially emotions, since at that age babies have no way of processing complex thoughts. But at some point the human infant learns to separate itself from mother, by developing these ego boundaries.

Maybe I should rewrite my essay to introduce this notion of ego boundaries, since it provides a broader perspective and a more complete explanation than the notion of narcissism, which pertains exclusively to ego identity.

Thank you for your critique, it helped me realize that this piece was missing!

Adur,

That is a great observation about the infants. I am curious, does DA or any other spiritual tradition you resonate with speak of humans as "microcosm of the macrocosm"? Since you are familiar with Barfield, you probably know where I am going with this. I think the macrocosmic evolutionary development of consciousness is the most critical and also the easiest concept for the intellect to grasp when approaching these deep philosophical-spiritual matters. I suspect that is why Steiner and Barfield emphasize it so much. And if that macrocosmic evolution is taken seriously, then the view of "parallel spiritual paths" going up the same mountain towards the same mountain peak is no longer tenable. What do you think?
"Most people would sooner regard themselves as a piece of lava in the moon than as an 'I'"
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