First time Ive seen Bernardo and Rupert in formal conversation, just watching it now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atq1frPdyxM&t=7s
2 Great Men
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Re: 2 Great Men
Brought to us by The Oxford Psychedelic Society ... Gotta love it !Starbuck wrote: ↑Sun Nov 14, 2021 2:59 pm First time Ive seen Bernardo and Rupert in formal conversation, just watching it now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atq1frPdyxM&t=7s
Here out of instinct or grace we seek
soulmates in these galleries of hieroglyph and glass,
where mutual longings and sufferings of love
are laid bare in transfigured exhibition of our hearts,
we who crave deep secrets and mysteries,
as elusive as the avatars of our dreams.
soulmates in these galleries of hieroglyph and glass,
where mutual longings and sufferings of love
are laid bare in transfigured exhibition of our hearts,
we who crave deep secrets and mysteries,
as elusive as the avatars of our dreams.
Re: 2 Great Men
Also, Bernardo wrote the Afterword in Rupert's latest book The Nature of Consciousness
"Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kanzas anymore" Dorothy
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Re: 2 Great Men
Yes, it's a really great format - Rupert and Bernardo versus the prevailing paradigm. In a way, it's a shame Christof did not acquaint himself with idealism before the show; it would have saved R&B having to explain themselves in so many different ways. On the other hand, this proved a useful way to demonstrate the scale of the problem and the nature of the solution.
I must say, though, that I'm not quite grokking Rupert's statement that "there is no absence of awareness, only awareness of absence". Seems a bit glib.
I must say, though, that I'm not quite grokking Rupert's statement that "there is no absence of awareness, only awareness of absence". Seems a bit glib.
Re: 2 Great Men
Ben Iscatus wrote: ↑Sun Nov 14, 2021 7:09 pm Yes, it's a really great format - Rupert and Bernardo versus the prevailing paradigm. In a way, it's a shame Christof did not acquaint himself with idealism before the show; it would have saved R&B having to explain themselves in so many different ways. On the other hand, this proved a useful way to demonstrate the scale of the problem and the nature of the solution.
I must say, though, that I'm not quite grokking Rupert's statement that "there is no absence of awareness, only awareness of absence". Seems a bit glib.
I'm starting to think these debates are a bit futile - from the perspective of trying to convince an entrenched materialist. A gauge of this would be the 'steel man' exercise. Bernardo and to some extent Rupert could argue Christof\s theory almost as well as he could. However if you asked the same of Christof you get the feeling he wouldn't know where to begin, or would make some fundamental false assumptions. And we are talking about an extremely intelligent person here. John Verveake (sp?) seems to be the only one who had achieved this.
Most people who get B and R are coming from a place of dissatisfaction with the prevailing paradigm. They dont fully understand it but invest time and often spiritual practice in order to do so. From Christof perspective, if it aint broke then why fix it.
Re: 2 Great Men
Exactly. No amount of philosophy can convince anyone who is satisfied with their current worldview.
"Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kanzas anymore" Dorothy
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Re: 2 Great Men
Hmm - it's easy to pretend it's not broke if you ignore the hard problem and don't even know what Idealism is...From Christof perspective, if it aint broke then why fix it.
Re: 2 Great Men
The pain of the hard problem is obviously less acute for him than the pain of professional ridicule, humility etc.Ben Iscatus wrote: ↑Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:21 pmHmm - it's easy to pretend it's not broke if you ignore the hard problem and don't even know what Idealism is...From Christof perspective, if it aint broke then why fix it.
For most on this forum the hard problem was a gnawing toothache that seemed like it wouldn't go away! Dr Bernardo fixed it for me I must say.