Jordan (H) Peterson chats with Curt Jaimungal about God, consciousness, Jung, etc.

[Soul_of_Shu]

Not a typo, guess what the clickbait 'H' stands for—though CJ was no doubt being a tad satirical ... This was first recorded in Nov 2021, but seems to have only just been posted today. Political fencing aside (though no doubt it may well have a trigger-effect), I feel there is enough metaphysical content offered up to be of some interest to some here, except for the JP detractors, with Noam Chomsky apparently among them ...

[AshvinP]

Not a typo, guess what the clickbait 'H' stands for—though CJ was no doubt being a tad satirical ... This was first recorded in Nov 2021, but seems to have only just been posted today. Political fencing aside (though no doubt it may well have a trigger-effect), I feel there is enough metaphysical content offered up to be of some interest to some here, except for the JP detractors, with Noam Chomsky apparently among them ...

It is somewhat painful for me to watch JP now, because he is always flirting around the skirts of a philosophy of spiritual activity. He is always asking the deepest questions, realizing none of the standard answers are adequate, but failing to consider that maybe some of the answers have already been found. There is really no reason he should be wasting time speaking to Richard Dawkins, but these things can seem like a productive endeavor if one does not know where else to look. JP still feels the concrete intersection of Divine Thinking and human thinking is yet to be found, even though he seems to know it must exist. Perhaps he really wants to be the one to find it, which appears to motivate a lot of public intellectuals these days. "Either I am the one to find it or no one is!" It's easy to see why nothing will be found that way. People will continue living in the sense-world and the spirit-world, which is only One interwoven World, none the wiser.

[Hedge90]

Not a typo, guess what the clickbait 'H' stands for—though CJ was no doubt being a tad satirical ... This was first recorded in Nov 2021, but seems to have only just been posted today. Political fencing aside (though no doubt it may well have a trigger-effect), I feel there is enough metaphysical content offered up to be of some interest to some here, except for the JP detractors, with Noam Chomsky apparently among them ...

It is somewhat painful for me to watch JP now, because he is always flirting around the skirts of a philosophy of spiritual activity. He is always asking the deepest questions, realizing none of the standard answers are adequate, but failing to consider that maybe some of the answers have already been found. There is really no reason he should be wasting time speaking to Richard Dawkins, but these things can seem like a productive endeavor if one does not know where else to look. JP still feels the concrete intersection of Divine Thinking and human thinking is yet to be found, even though he seems to know it must exist. Perhaps he really wants to be the one to find it, which appears to motivate a lot of public intellectuals these days. "Either I am the one to find it or no one is!" It's easy to see why nothing will be found that way. People will continue living in the sense-world and the spirit-world, which is only One interwoven World, none the wiser.

JP is "flirting around the skirts" of many things. For me the most blatant is how he's always on and on about psychedelics, without ever having tried one. It's obvious he has constructed a concept in his head about what a psychedelic experience is like, and he'd probably be pretty shocked if he found out what it's really like.

[Soul_of_Shu]

It is somewhat painful for me to watch JP now ...

Sheesh, seems every chat I post now is like torture for you ... In an oh-so-Canadian way, I'm sorrrry

[Soul_of_Shu]

It is somewhat painful for me to watch JP now ...

Sheesh, seems every chat I post now is like torture for you ... In an oh-so-Canadian way, I'm sorrrry

I suppose on a hopeful note, even with JP's tortuous, circumambulating approach, never quite taking the deeper dive, given his massive audience, even if only as a jumping off point he's getting them to consider looking on their own into those deep explorations, and then possibly expanding from there, that's not insignificant.

[AshvinP]

It is somewhat painful for me to watch JP now ...

Sheesh, seems every chat I post now is like torture for you ... In an oh-so-Canadian way, I'm sorrrry
...
I suppose on a hopeful note, even with JP's tortuous, circumambulating approach, never quite taking the deeper dive, given his massive audience, even if only as a jumping off point he's getting them to consider looking on their own into those deep explorations, and then possibly expanding from there, that's not insignificant.

There is no doubt about that. It's the fact that he's so close and has such a wide reach that's the tortuous part. I really think if only he sat down to read PoF, it would illuminate so many things he is already expressing and that, in turn, would reach many people in the world. However, I have also come to realize these things are not up to any individual, they unfold according to deep spiritual laws and the great Wisdom of the Cosmos, and, therefore, I shouldn't let it torture me in that way. There is definitely no need for you to apologize. Keep posting away!

[lorenzop]

There is no doubt about that. It's the fact that he's so close and has such a wide reach that's the tortuous part. I really think if only he sat down to read PoF, it would illuminate so many things he is already expressing and that, in turn, would reach many people in the world. However, I have also come to realize these things are not up to any individual, they unfold according to deep spiritual laws and the great Wisdom of the Cosmos, and, therefore, I shouldn't let it torture me in that way. There is definitely no need for you to apologize. Keep posting away!

Let's say he (or anyone else) read PoF . . . then read and understood Kant, Goethe and maybe Hegel.
After maybe years of study, one now maybe has all the best words in just the perfect arrangement . . . has that Perfect Idea in the mind . . . it's not worth a hill of beans.
One can't entertain that one perfect idea all day and all night without lapse - and even if one could, it's just a thought.

[Ben Iscatus]

However, I have also come to realize these things are not up to any individual, they unfold according to... the great Wisdom of the Cosmos

I have to agree with this!

[AshvinP]

There is no doubt about that. It's the fact that he's so close and has such a wide reach that's the tortuous part. I really think if only he sat down to read PoF, it would illuminate so many things he is already expressing and that, in turn, would reach many people in the world. However, I have also come to realize these things are not up to any individual, they unfold according to deep spiritual laws and the great Wisdom of the Cosmos, and, therefore, I shouldn't let it torture me in that way. There is definitely no need for you to apologize. Keep posting away!

Let's say he (or anyone else) read PoF . . . then read and understood Kant, Goethe and maybe Hegel.
After maybe years of study, one now maybe has all the best words in just the perfect arrangement . . . has that Perfect Idea in the mind . . . it's not worth a hill of beans.
One can't entertain that one perfect idea all day and all night without lapse - and even if one could, it's just a thought.

That's what we are saying - if one really understands PoF, they come into contact with the Spirit within who brings deadened thoughts/ideas back to life. The person who experiences this will then find sound qualitative thinking the most thrilling experience. Then they will begin to understand Goethe meant when he said,

"All truly wise thoughts have been thought already thousands of times; but to make them truly ours, we must think them over again honestly, until they take root in our personal experience."

Then thinking is no longer a dry affair, but manifestation of our Divinity in the world. People miss out on so much because they simply assume the way they experience and think is the way everyone has always experienced and thought, and will always experience and think. No massive philosophical study is necessary, only honest approach and good will of one 200 page book. Look at Cleric here - he barely mentions any philosophers, but clearly thinking and expressing his thinking in writing is an inspired activity for him. That is why I think Peterson would immediately recognize the power within PoF, since he shares that joy in imaginative and inspired thinking, and would see the infinite value of conquering anew the spiritual ideas expressed through Steiner. The intersection between rigorous logic and immensely creative thinking activity is unimaginable for most, but is right there for anyone who wants to begin experiencing it.

[Lou Gold]

There is no doubt about that. It's the fact that he's so close and has such a wide reach that's the tortuous part. I really think if only he sat down to read PoF, it would illuminate so many things he is already expressing and that, in turn, would reach many people in the world. However, I have also come to realize these things are not up to any individual, they unfold according to deep spiritual laws and the great Wisdom of the Cosmos, and, therefore, I shouldn't let it torture me in that way. There is definitely no need for you to apologize. Keep posting away!

Let's say he (or anyone else) read PoF . . . then read and understood Kant, Goethe and maybe Hegel.
After maybe years of study, one now maybe has all the best words in just the perfect arrangement . . . has that Perfect Idea in the mind . . . it's not worth a hill of beans.
One can't entertain that one perfect idea all day and all night without lapse - and even if one could, it's just a thought.