AshvinP wrote: ↑Thu Sep 15, 2022 7:28 pm Federica,
I didn't change anything - you are simply misunderstanding what I was calling "tenuous" the first time. I have never questioned your understanding of PoF or that 'desire' chapter. The only thing I have been questioning is your sentiment that there is a discrepancy between Steiner and that one section in Part 3 of Max's summary - that is what I called a tenuous argument the first and second time. I hardly feel the need to 'prove' what I intended by 'tenuous' the first time. I didn't question whether Steiner differentiated 'desire' and 'pleasure' in that chapter, but why you were using that in connection with what Max wrote, since he makes the same differentiation.
Why does this matter? Good question - that's also what I have been questioning. Supposedly it is important for us to make sure other people are not "confused" by this tiny section, as you were. But in the process of trying to clear up this "confusion", we have generated more confusion, as evidenced by Mike's comment. He feels the confusion is inherent to the subject matter itself, which I'm sure we both disagree with.
Feel free to respond to the above, but, for my part, instead of discussing further whether or not it is confusing and the history of our comments trying to figure out the why/how of what the other person is doing in their responses, I suggest we focus on what it all means for penetrating deeper into the spiritual depth structure, with our spiritual activity, which PoF leads us up to. What does freeing ourselves from the 'tyranny of arbitrary desires' have to do with evolving higher cognition and moral conscience, in freedom? Here's one angle to consider it from.
A simple illustration may indicate the first steps. The very best mechanic is well-nigh helpless without the tools of his craft. Indeed it is the hall-mark of a good artisan that he is very fastidious as to the quality and condition of the tools he uses, because he knows that the work depends as much upon their excellence as upon his skill.
The Ego has several instruments--a dense body, a vital body, a desire body, and a mind. These are its tools and upon their quality and condition depends how much or how little it can accomplish in its work of gathering experience in each life. If the instruments are poor and dull there will be but little spiritual growth and the life will be a barren one, so far as the spirit is concerned.
We generally estimate a "successful" life by the bank account, the social position attained, or the happiness resulting from a carefree existence and a sheltered environment. When life is regarded is that way all the principal things that make for permanency are forgotten; the individual is blinded by the evanescent and illusionary. A bank account seems such a very real success, the fact is forgotten that from the moment the Ego leaves the body, it has no equity in gold nor any other earthly treasure. It may even have to answer for the methods employed in amassing that hoard and suffer great pain in seeing others spend it. It is forgotten that the important social position also disappears when the silver cord is loosed. Those who once fawned may then sneer, and even those who were faithful in life might shudder at the thought of an hour spent with no company but that of the dead. All that is of this life alone is vanity. Only that is of true value which can be taken with us across the threshold as the treasure of the spirit.
...
Without well-kept tools the mechanic can do no effective work; similarly, the instruments of the Ego must be cleansed and sharpened; then we may commence work to some purpose. As one works with those wonderful tools they themselves improve with proper use and become more and more efficient to aid in the work. The object of this work is Union with the Higher Self.
Heindel , Max. The Rosicrucian Cosmo Conception (Illustrated) (pp. 416-417). Kindle Edition.
I am relieved to drop all the previous Ashvin, and happy to focus on something substantial instead. That’s refreshing, thank you. I will reflect on your question and quote by Heindel. I have only just started reading Theosophy. I look forward to understanding more about the lawfulness / precise science that connects choice of desires with development of cognition.
PS. Regarding disagreeing with Mike's comment, I have had enough disagreement for today, I will save that for tomorrow : )