Simon Adams wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 1:05 am
That said, there are still regulations from the EU which set a minimum level of welfare. From what I understand, in the US there are no regulations on welfare? The farmers are also allowed to routinely give antibiotics and steroids just to increase profits, and you have to pay extra for beef from cows that ate grass! It sounds even more grim than here.
The only area where I have some knowledge is EU regulation of herbicides etc. poisons in horticulture. When I was studying in gardening school, there was still a test about use of poisons, but that went away as EU gradually banned most poisons and the test became meaningless. Attempts to ban glyphosate (Round-up etc.) have been strong, but so far the system has succeeded to resist strong pressure against glyphosate, as it's very important for current version of no-till agriculture.
Correction, just checked, glyphosate use seems to be allowed only until end of next year (15th December 2022), after which it's banned.
I suspect the EU regulation is more strict also in cattle farming than in US, but as I have no detailed information, can't really comment on that. Veganism and animal rights movements are strong social currents and keep on growing among the youth.
If with every bottle we imagine that we are symbolically also removing an impurity from our soul and then radiate waves of light and clarity in the atmosphere, we are really changing something in the etheric structures.
Not sure this is true. There's always a repressed shadow side. If it isn't manifesting in you, it will manifest through other people.
It's not about getting rid of the shadow side. As a matter of fact if we lose it from sight it means that it is behind our back and pulling our strings. It's the opposite - we should see it clearly at all times and put it to work. The shadow side (in the sense of untamed, destructive) is raw energy. We need that energy, we can't do anything without it. But it must be channelized. This energy is like uncontained electricity - if we don't know how to handle it, we burn ourselves and set our house on fire. If we are wise, we use it to propel our systems for the benefit of all.
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them." ~ Albert Einstein
It seems unlikely that such outmoded thinking is going to be legislated out of the collective by a dysfunctional and impotent political ethos still mired in that outmoded thinking, with its polarized divide stalemated between 'Sprite Zero' and 'Orange Crush' options, all symptomatic of the segregated identity notion. How have all the countless laws against 'sin' really been working? Not very well if the prison population is any indication. Debate and argue here all one wants about politics-as-usual making some marginal difference. Nonetheless, still best practice and endeavour to be a living exemplar of some (r)evolutionary awakening into a new integral mode and way that transcends us-vs-them thinking, as the difference that makes a difference, such that those who are ripe to do so might pay heed ... yet a work in progress for this psyche.
Here out of instinct or grace we seek
soulmates in these galleries of hieroglyph and glass,
where mutual longings and sufferings of love
are laid bare in transfigured exhibition of our hearts,
we who crave deep secrets and mysteries,
as elusive as the avatars of our dreams.
Lou Gold wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 11:20 am
The Devil is in the details and there are always details. India had an interesting evolution of its sacred cow vegetarianism that generated the unforeseen burden of having to feed the unwanted male cow babies. So they killed them to market to the meat-eating Muslims and thus became one of the top beef exporters in the world. Learning, whichever way it unfolds, is a mix of awareness and events co-arising interdependently and not a linear progressive hierarchical evolution.
I'm not sure what to make out of you example. If it is an example showing how vegetarianism can turn into a disaster then that's what I was also saying. I'm not pro-vegetarianism, I'm pro-awareness - ever expanding awareness. Then diet choice is the result of that awareness and not something forced from outside. I'm not very familiar with the details of these sacred cow stuff but what you describe looks like a perfect example of what happens when ancient traditions are dogmatically perpetuated while disregarding that times move forward and conditions change.
OK. Circling about again. I will yield and simply accept you as a committed dualist who chooses to see stuff as an either/or choice, which I do not see. However, the moment I express a seeming opposing view, I will fall into the same trap. Instead, I will follow the advice of my Padrinho. "Be calm - Be clear - See the faults - See the suffering - Give your love" and add with my own voice, "If everyone did that, we might find a better way. I can't say that's for certain but the promise of perhaps is enough to fill my heart in a happy way."
Be calm - Be clear - See the faults - See the suffering - Give your love
Same old circle game that Lou apparently loves playing by posting topics seemingly bound to perpetuate the game
Here out of instinct or grace we seek
soulmates in these galleries of hieroglyph and glass,
where mutual longings and sufferings of love
are laid bare in transfigured exhibition of our hearts,
we who crave deep secrets and mysteries,
as elusive as the avatars of our dreams.
OK. If the master philosophy is perfect balance of all dualities here and now then let's just close this forum. Because as we strive to gain awareness and perspective, through mysterious ways we're condemning others to stupidity and dullness
Soul_of_Shu wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 2:11 pm
Same old circle game that Lou apparently loves playing by posting topics seemingly bound to perpetuate the game
EXACTLY! This is what the kid does. The emperor has no clothes.
Be calm - Be clear - See the faults - See the suffering - Give your love
Cleric K wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:30 pm
I'm very happy for your cleaning efforts! Even though physically it has questionable results, it has much larger spiritual impact. Especially if we do these things as spiritual exercises. If we pick the bottle and think "pigs, rascals!" we're doing only half of the job. If with every bottle we imagine that we are symbolically also removing an impurity from our soul and then radiate waves of light and clarity in the atmosphere, we are really changing something in the etheric structures. Then next time when someone passes by, just before he drops the bottle his brain my capture a tiny particle of what we've radiated there and without knowing why, decides to carry it few meters more until the next bin. Even if that doesn't happen, we've still done something beneficial for ourselves, the physical and spiritual environment.
Well said, yes you do need to make the effort not to think “disgusting pigs”, and it’s actually surprisingly enjoyable and rewarding. I’ve seen a few others doing it since and it seems to be spreading, so yes these things we do (positive or negative) can radiate around. I’ve done enough of both to know which feels better in the long run.
Ideas are certain original forms of things, their archetypes, permanent and incommunicable, which are contained in the Divine intelligence. And though they neither begin to be nor cease, yet upon them are patterned the manifold things of the world that come into being and pass away.
St Augustine
Cleric K wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:30 pm
I'm very happy for your cleaning efforts! Even though physically it has questionable results, it has much larger spiritual impact. Especially if we do these things as spiritual exercises. If we pick the bottle and think "pigs, rascals!" we're doing only half of the job. If with every bottle we imagine that we are symbolically also removing an impurity from our soul and then radiate waves of light and clarity in the atmosphere, we are really changing something in the etheric structures. Then next time when someone passes by, just before he drops the bottle his brain my capture a tiny particle of what we've radiated there and without knowing why, decides to carry it few meters more until the next bin. Even if that doesn't happen, we've still done something beneficial for ourselves, the physical and spiritual environment.
Well said, yes you do need to make the effort not to think “disgusting pigs”, and it’s actually surprisingly enjoyable and rewarding. I’ve seen a few others doing it since and it seems to be spreading, so yes these things we do (positive or negative) can radiate around. I’ve done enough of both to know which feels better in the long run.
These are excellent points raised in this thread. When we hold ourselves to higher standards, we are truly bringing about change within ourselves and those around us. Faith in our capacity as individuals is not other than faith in our reality as Divine beings. One of the largest sacrificial offerings we can make is of our own self-image as limited, powerless creatures, to dwell forever within the apparent safety of external orders and norms. Rather, we must we give up the relative "safety" of adhering to such dictates in order to venture out beyond them into the 'unexplored' territory of our own moral imagination. As long as we feel our sacrifices for the collective well-being are necessitated by anything external to us, by this or that person, institution, or deity, we remain unfree and ineffectual.
"Most people would sooner regard themselves as a piece of lava in the moon than as an 'I'"
