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Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:06 pm
by AshvinP
SanteriSatama wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:47 am
AshvinP wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:47 am Culture is what naturally happens when human souls sense themselves to be distinct from the soul of Nature. The infant and sleeping adult exist in modes which do not reflect and therefore do not experience any distinction. Eventually, in the modern era, that distinction becomes total division from Nature, which of course is not an accurate perspective. The most common mistake on the other "nature-loving" end, though, is to assume Nature is exhausted by what we perceive in physical forms and processes, rather than the specified spiritual forces bringing those forms forth. One cuts humanity off from Nature from 'below', failing to see how nature brings their physical existence forth, and the other cuts Nature off from higher spiritual beings 'above', failing to see how those beings bring forth nature.
This is not exactly at odds with what I was trying to say. Luonto rises from the ground, from the below, in this bodily experiencing. Of course also infant and sleeping adult are also wearing their light etc. reflecting costumes. And when an infant comes to this world from mothers womb and opens its eyes for the first time, we can see in its first gaze the ancient wisdom of stars.

Culture - tilling of the Land - can become uncaring and unhealthy relation with Land, carving Land with iron and doing so beyond what is reasonable, the alienating "Fall". And also the near total cut between Above and Below. Which makes me think of the symboll of cross.

As the waveform is very foundational, or most foundational idea in this universe, a field of waveform does not need to be bivalent either-or, but various more-less degrees of Above and Below, weaving our variance. Thus the horizontal line does not signify only cut, but also the heart level, where Below and Above mingle and unite and are felt as pain and joy and other forms of love.

'Land' is a good old Germanic word. It is strong, it has power. From Fall to Rebirth means also and especially reconnecting with Land. Kissing the Ground with your every step, as a poet said.
I like those lines very much! There is definitely an ancient Wisdom from our collective youth who needs to be rediscovered, thereby allowing Nature and Culture to exist harmoniously.

Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:23 pm
by SanteriSatama
Cleric K wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:13 pm I've made this clear in other posts - evil, the shadow, will be reintegrated. But this we can accomplish only by developing our Light core. It's the radiant Sun that at the same time protects us from harmful elements (who can hurt the Sun? Anything thrown at the Sun evaporates instantly) but also transforms, vivifies, ennobles, illuminates everything.
Yes, the fiery core! That was the symbolic-sentient locus of transformation in the highly integrated state of the first experience, after declaring a spiritual battle and entering what I could then only describe as "weird state". In this bodily awareness the fiery core was in the abdomen, the Guts.

In terms of directions and elements, we should not think of only Sun. As Above, So Below, and my association has been more with the fiery core of Mother Earth. There's a classical meditation of linking Sun and Earth-core together in bodily awareness, which could be helpful and worth a try.

After the first 'break-through' experience things don't need to be as dramatic. Heart, the seat of compassion, can learn to do the transformation work (semi-)automatically, without metacognitive attention. Of course I can speak only from this experience, I can only tell what is possible by empirical evidence, not make any universal claims of only one correct way or form. Each of us gives the Spirit our own unique form. And I have confidence that sharing narratives of our experiences can be helpfull in the long run. The old way used to be more private and secretive, now we are integrating also in the direction of global village, which calls for more open and inclusive sharing.

In the spirit of sharing our stories, I'd like to tell also about my encounter with the Void. The Language of the World had been pestering me with the form-idea of hour glass (which I now realize symbolizes also Minkowski time-space etc.). Driven by my curiosity, to test a hunch I desided to go through the Below-bottom of the hour glass and return back from the Above, traveling the Void around. It worked. :)

Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:42 pm
by Soul_of_Shu
DandelionSoul wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:00 am
SanteriSatama wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:47 am
Process ontology... I went from Heraclitus to David Bohm in my teens. Who are your most influential names in that process? Whitehead?
Whitehead is on my list, but I haven't been brave enough to approach him yet.
Matt Segall IMO qualifies as a Whitehead specialist who is able to deconstruct his unusual terminology, and render his ideas about as simply and comprehensibly as anyone can. If you haven't already, you may want to check him out.

Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:49 pm
by Soul_of_Shu
And for another good exploration of Whitehead's ideas vis-a-vis BK's model, here's a 'dialogos' to check out.


Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:05 pm
by DandelionSoul
Soul_of_Shu wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:42 pm
DandelionSoul wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:00 am
SanteriSatama wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:47 am
Whitehead is on my list, but I haven't been brave enough to approach him yet.
Matt Segall IMO qualifies as a Whitehead specialist who is able to deconstruct his unusual terminology, and render his ideas about as simply and comprehensibly as anyone can. If you haven't already, you may want to check him out.
You are a scholar and a gentleperson. Thank you!

Re: Bernardo's latest essay

Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:10 pm
by SanteriSatama
Soul_of_Shu wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:49 pm And for another good exploration of Whitehead's ideas vis-a-vis BK's model, here's a 'dialogos' to check out.
Big thanks for both links!