Life circumstances

[Stranger]

What is paranoia cleric, is it just imagining things that could happen or evil beings wanting to harm me? I'm a bit confused at the moment and I apologize if the writing isn't coherent.

Güney, sorry, you asked Cleric but let me add a comment. I saw this happening with some of my family members. When you feel very confused, unable to think clearly, and experience strong paranoic thoughts intruding your mind and dragging you into the state of fear and paranoia, it may be a sign of coming psychosis, so it is important to recognize it as soon as possible and get help from a psychiatrist. As we said above, this help should be only a temporary measure to prevent or heal from the psychotic state, but paranoic psychosis is a decease and can do a lot of harm to psychological well-being, so it is always better to avoid it by getting professional help. The real problem is that once people collapse into psychosis, they become unable to ask for professional help and unable to manage their state themselves, and if they do not have relatives or friends who can take care of them, that may lead to catastrophic outcomes (including suicide or other harmful actions).

[Güney27]

Hi Güney,

First let me say that I really feel compassion for you and feel your pain. Let me try a few suggestions that may help, in addition to what Cleric suggested about prayer.

- I'm not suggesting to disregard the deaths of your friends, but there is nothing tragic in our human deaths, our souls are immortal and only go through various incarnations, so birth and death is as natural and falling asleep and waking up. Be sure that the souls of your friends are alive and doing great on their next stage of the journey. Of course, you still miss them, that's understandable.

- I myself went through a terrible period of depression and suicidal thoughts, but eventually it brought me to the realization of my fundamental nature as Consciousness. Sometimes we need to go through severe circumstances to break through our habitual systems of mind patterns and worldviews. We are all One Timeless/Eternal Consciousness evolving and exploring itself by imagining the worlds in time and experiencing them through its individuated spiritual activities (our souls). But regardless of what happens in these souls' experiences, nothing can change the fact that we are always the same Consciousness, and nothing can damage and affect Consciousness on its fundamental level of Being and being Aware. This is not to disregard what happens in our life circumstances (they are important on their own account), but just to note that, from the Cosmic perspective, there is nothing to be afraid about. Nothing can harm or destroy Consciousness, it is timeless and indestructible, and overall it knows what it is doing and everything goes according to its Telos.

- On the practical side you still need to fix your human life and get back on track, and the first thing to do is to take care of yourself, specifically your psychological condition. Your condition may be related to some bodily causes (hormonal or neurotransmitter disbalances) and so may be referring to a physician or even psychiatrist and taking some anti-depressant or other medication would help. Also, it is of course your choice, and I do not know about your circumstances, but getting a good education or training in some trade will help you to have stable jobs and financial independence in your future life and get you back on track. And definitely JUST SAY NO TO DRUGS, they only harm and never do any good (I've been there and did that). Be sure you can always find support from your friends, including people on this forum.

- And finally, it is important to continue spiritual practice and have faith in your overall soul's progress and in the values and meanings in your life. We all learn from mistakes and hard circumstances, as they say, "what does not destroy us makes us stronger".

Eugene
Thank you for your contribution.

Your statements sound like mooji or Rupert spria's statements. Of course, this is not a judgment about these people. What about demonic influences trying to pull souls away from the evolution of consciousness.
What if souls eventually fall into unconsciousness through deevolution? Are there also real enemy powers in your world view?
If I'm not mistaken, are these the hierarchies for you?
Sorry if I put the wrong word in my mouth, please correct me.

For medical help.
I've been to psychologists and won't go to them again. Even with highly respected psychologists. They wanted to give me medication and none of them ever helped me, except for standard sayings like do sport and go out in the sun. I do sports and also go out in the sun, I don't want to say that these things are unimportant. I think psychologists, how young one was, are an absolute rarity. Drugs and spells will never satisfy the thirst for wisdom. The psychologists I saw were all materialistic-minded atheists. When I was talking about God and asking questions, someone told me that I'm confused, and nowadays we don't need to believe because science can explain everything. We humans are like leaves on a tree, we cling to the tree of life and then fall off and dissolve. This statement scared me enormously at the time, because I think that the nihilism that can arise from such statements is a dangerous thing.
Psychologists know abstract theory, but this is not always true and neglects all spiritual aspects, which must be essential if they exist.
In addition, I don't really trust conventional medicine, because one thing is a fact for me, pharmacy is pure business, which is run by power-hungry and hedonistic people. I don't trust my body to people with such attributes.

Best regards

[Güney27]

What is paranoia cleric, is it just imagining things that could happen or evil beings wanting to harm me? I'm a bit confused at the moment and I apologize if the writing isn't coherent.

Güney, sorry, you asked Cleric but let me add a comment. I saw this happening with some of my family members. When you feel very confused, unable to think clearly, and experience strong paranoic thoughts intruding your mind and dragging you into the state of fear and paranoia, it may be a sign of coming psychosis, so it is important to recognize it as soon as possible and get help from a psychiatrist. As we said above, this help should be only a temporary measure to prevent or heal from the psychotic state, but paranoic psychosis is a decease and can do a lot of harm to psychological well-being, so it is always better to avoid it by getting professional help. The real problem is that once people collapse into psychosis, they become unable to ask for professional help and unable to manage their state themselves, and if they do not have relatives or friends who can take care of them, that may lead to catastrophic outcomes (including suicide or other harmful actions).

Thanks very much.
It's not always like that, it's partly in certain of the same situations that these thoughts come up. I watch them and I can think clearly despite the confusion.
But I've always been somewhat paranoid and have always read a lot into things, but it's gotten stronger over the last few years. Like I said, I don't want to take any medication. I believe there is a solution to these things outside of known psycholo

[Stranger]

Thanks very much.
It's not always like that, it's partly in certain of the same situations that these thoughts come up. I watch them and I can think clearly despite the confusion.
But I've always been somewhat paranoid and have always read a lot into things, but it's gotten stronger over the last few years. Like I said, I don't want to take any medication. I believe there is a solution to these things outside of known psycholo

Right, as long as you are sure you can manage it yourself and remain on track then there is no reason to use medication.

[AshvinP]

Thanks for your help ashvin.
I can get my finances under control again. I have some savings and I also quit my apartment because I will probably lose my job next month. But that's actually not so bad for me. My savings will last me for about 1 year and I live modestly.

I don't understand the Bible at all. From my current perspective, I read the Bible like a poem, but the esoteric content remains completely hidden from me. I don't find Rudolf Steiner's texts enriching either. In general, I find that Rudolf Steiner writes very unsystematically and inaccessibly. I think scaligero and a few others are better. Is there a prayer I can say for the dead? I know the Lord's Prayer by heart and pray it several times a day, but as I said, after months, it hasn't had any consciously noticeable effect on me. Why is Jesus always associated with light? I think there shouldn't be any light in the spiritual world. How should one perceive this without sense organs and nervous system? Does this mean an esoteric aspect of light?
Eugene has often spoken about NDE's in whichever light plays a role

Guney,

That's good about the savings. I hope they didn't charge a two month termination fee for the apartment lease, and you are able to get the deposit back!

I will wait to see what Cleric responds on this topic of prayers for the dead. Probably I won't have much useful thoughts to add. Although I have some understanding of the gradient which needs to be built between the living and the dead (like the physical and spiritual consciousness in general), I have not personally made much effort in this direction.

On Light - it is truly the outer manifestation of Thinking. It's interesting that we don't actually perceive the Light itself, only its reflection in colors and illuminated objects. Likewise we don't perceive our present thinking, only its reflection in thoughts and perceptions. He says, "The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you—they are full of the Spirit and life." What are words except the products of our thinking? Christ is not only the Light, though, but also the Warmth of the Divine Will, of Love. He is the Sun-Spirit who radiates Light and Warmth in the darkness of the physical-sensory world, from within our souls.

So we should remember, we are always living in the spiritual worlds with our thinking. The latter is the esoteric dimension of Light. Normally this true Light is dulled out by the light of our desire for sensory perceptions and sense-based concepts, but it is nevertheless present. Your inner life is the spirit world. This is where the dead and the higher heirarchies are active. Of course the question naturally arises, then why don't they just make sure my inner life is always in order and harmonious like the orbit of the planets? That's precisely the question we need to answer for ourselves through spiritual maturation. We can speak of suffering as necessary for moral agency, freedom, becoming spiritually creative beings, etc., but these remain abstract placeholders until we can grow into them with our inner understanding.

I know that seems like a major obstacle for you now, like nothing is coming of your efforts, but let's remember, you are 19 and just recently starting on a spiritual path. Probably most of us here didn't have a clue about any of these things at your age, and took much longer to progress as well. I certainly didn't know the Lord's Prayer by heart or pray daily, let alone read someone like Scaligero. Now I can only reminisce that it would have been a fantastic opportunity for me to grow in Spirit (of course I try not to live in the past, either). What your Karma has brought you into contact with at such a young age is a great gift from the Divine world, even though it doesn't seem like that at all right now. Remember two days ago, though, you wrote:

Federica
Thank you for your valuable comment.
You summed it up really well and showed that our thoughts are more than words. Our word-thoughts are the skin of a shedding snake or the visible surface of the ocean. You have a talent for making things easy to understand. Thinking back to months of trying to understand Cleric's posts, I realize I couldn't understand them because I was trying to squeeze these things into a chain of mental representations. But somehow over time and asking (yes, I even wished in my prayers that I understand what is being said.)... This forum helped me to heal.

Things definitely change and will continue to change in our life circumstances and our soul development, that is always part and parcel of spiritual evolution, but what you felt before this latest tragedy was also real and it will return. The increase in understanding and your ability to express that understanding on this forum, which has clearly improved to any objective observer, is nothing other than the experience of spiritual growth, the fruits of the Spirit.

[Stranger]

Eugene
Thank you for your contribution.

Your statements sound like mooji or Rupert spria's statements. Of course, this is not a judgment about these people. What about demonic influences trying to pull souls away from the evolution of consciousness.
What if souls eventually fall into unconsciousness through deevolution? Are there also real enemy powers in your world view?
If I'm not mistaken, are these the hierarchies for you?
Sorry if I put the wrong word in my mouth, please correct me.

I do accept that there likely exist discarnate hierarchical forces playing their polarity role in the evolutionary process (which I discussed in the "Demiurge" thread). It is indeed quite possible that some souls can slip into a de-evolutionary path eventually possibly leading to some collapsed "black hole" states. I do not know if a recovery would be possible for them or not. But I believe that they can only influence us but cannot force us off-track from our evolutionary path against our will. We may temporarily slip into unconscious states and go off-track, but as long as we recover, eventually that will only make us stronger and more mature, help us to develop immunity and better understand the tricks of the de-evolutionary forces and pitfalls on the evolutionary path. We also know that these forces can masquerade themselves as being benevolent, but it is always possible to discern their intensions by looking through their messages and seeing where they are trying to steer us and what are their intentions, so developing spiritual discernment and being aware of this side of spiritual reality is important. This is not to become paranoid of them, but just to be cautious but also be sure that they cannot harm us against our will unless we willfully agree with their arguments or influences on us.

But it is also important to know that one of the ways they can influence us is by inducing feelings of fear. By dragging us into fear they lower and narrow our spiritual perspective so we become more easily susceptible for their manipulation. But, as there are negative polarity sources, there are also positive polarity ones that can always help us, and a good way to get help from them is prayer and openness to them and attuning to their spiritual state of higher cognition, love and peace etc.

I agree that many teachers like Spira or Mooji disregard these spiritual realities, their approach is more secular, which is still useful for secular people (as they also need spiritual help).

For medical help.
I've been to psychologists and won't go to them again. Even with highly respected psychologists. They wanted to give me medication and none of them ever helped me, except for standard sayings like do sport and go out in the sun. I do sports and also go out in the sun, I don't want to say that these things are unimportant. I think psychologists, how young one was, are an absolute rarity. Drugs and spells will never satisfy the thirst for wisdom. The psychologists I saw were all materialistic-minded atheists. When I was talking about God and asking questions, someone told me that I'm confused, and nowadays we don't need to believe because science can explain everything. We humans are like leaves on a tree, we cling to the tree of life and then fall off and dissolve. This statement scared me enormously at the time, because I think that the nihilism that can arise from such statements is a dangerous thing.
Psychologists know abstract theory, but this is not always true and neglects all spiritual aspects, which must be essential if they exist.
In addition, I don't really trust conventional medicine, because one thing is a fact for me, pharmacy is pure business, which is run by power-hungry and hedonistic people. I don't trust my body to people with such attributes.

Best regards

I agree that psychologists rarely help, unless they themselves are aware of the spiritual side of reality and can offer useful advice from that perspective, but unfortunately that is very rare. I was only talking about getting medical help and only in case of clinical conditions (like clinical depression or psychosis).

[Federica]

(...)

Güney,
As I read your thoughts, it's clear they are spinning very fast. They are not easy to tame right now, and it's near to impossible to slow them down and consider them in tranquillity. If this is how you feel, I would recommend you something.

You mentioned that you are using tobacco these days, and it's completely understandable, I am not suggesting that you try to change that now. What I am suggesting is that you give a moment of conscious attention to the fact that tobacco is causing a baseline of anxiety in your body, that all other causes of anxiety add to. The real problem with this effect is that it is unnoticed, unconscious. So it will be healing for you that you expose it.

So, in the moment you feel the wave of anxiety - with many thoughts assaulting you at the same time, fighting for your attention - press pause, just for one second, try to make a clean sweep of all the thoughts at once, and think this one thought instead:
"Much of this anxiety is nicotine. Right now I feel the need to use it, and it's OK.
But I do know that one thing is me, and another thing is this anxiety. The anxiety is a by-product of nicotine."

This would be enough, if you really manage to do it. Just like in our phenomenology discussion on the other thread, if you manage to bring awareness to the by-product (anxiety) and how it builds up into your system, it will be enough to start a process when you are elevating yourself on top of things again. It will take you a few seconds every time, it's just about not forgetting to think that thought, next time the wave comes.