Intuition, thinking and Antroposophy

[Cleric K]

I'll try to give my understanding of cleric's essay CT as they may have more resonance on the forum than steiner's.
Ashvin's answer reminded me of the content of Cleric's essay

I still have questions that came up while I was writing.


Citation:
But notice the big difference - this fly cannot surprise us because we grasp the temporal law of its movement, we live in its meaning by thinking the movement.


What do you mean by meaning, in that word.
What is the meaning of the movement of a fly? She moves erratically and that's about it I would say.
I think I don't understand the usage here.

By meaning I mean that we live in the temporal intuition of the movement. Maybe you expect 'meaning' here to have some deeper significance, as if the movement of the fly is a part of a world peace program or some other grand endeavor (and in fact we can find such deeper significance if we want - we can conceive that the exercise is part of our attempts to better understand reality. From that perspective we don't move that imaginary fly for nothing, there's certain purpose and meaning, even if the movement itself looks erratic).

If some external observer could see our imaginary fly it would be just as unpredictable as the real one. He would say that the imaginary fly moves erratically. But there's difference between the erratic as the person grasps it and the erratic that we experience when imagining the movement. It is this difference that the example tries to point out.

Is our ego equated with our mental activity, of which thinking is only the end product?
If so, how is our thinking shaped by other beings, feelings, ideas and so on.
Do these things live in our self(i) or is there a separation. Or is our ego not involved in the unfolding of thoughts

At the most basic level you can reflect on the ways other human beings shape your feelings and ideas. For example, that person who insulted you or the girl that smiled at you and you now can't stop thinking of her. Do these people shape your thoughts and feelings?

It is similar with spiritual beings. There's constant interference of spiritual activity. Give some consideration of the riverbed metaphor. The whole Cosmos is your riverbed. You body, nervous system and sense organs are only the focal point. There are also finer aspects of the riverbed - your etheric, astral, mental sheaths. With your spirit (the water) you flow through the riverbed. It shapes you but you can also shape it. Since your riverbed is the whole Cosmos, it means that the way you work upon it manifests in the experiences of other focal points. Maybe if you smile to somebody their thoughts and feelings will also be shaped in some way. Things are difficult only when we try to imagine that there are parts of our existence that are completely ours. Even our thoughts are not completely ours because not a single thought can be what it is if there wasn't the whole Cosmos to support it.

suppose we see a tree, how do we form a thinking gesture like we do with verbs?
And how does this gesture help us understand what a tree is?
For this we would first have to analyze the perception of the tree with our thinking.

You can experiment by following the reverse path of the light. When you have a perception of the tree you can say that you experience certain specific configuration in your physical and etheric brain. But then you can begin to trace these configurations. You can move your attention from you experience in the head, through the eyes and imagine you follow the threads of light towards the tree. Then try to feel the form of the tree, touch it with your thoughts from all sides, follow the branches. It's the same you would do with your hands if you place them on the trunk and glide them towards a branch, reaching the leaves, feeling their form. Try to follow the floods of sunlight as they are absorbed by the leaves. Follow the moisture in the soil as it is sucked by the roots and moves as sap.

The goal of such exercises is not to imagine that these imaginative forms and movements are the actual reality of the tree. The goal is to go beyond ourselves and fill the environment with thoughts. Then later, as crazy it may sound, we'll see that we can think not only with the interior of our body but with the whole environment. Of course the thought that can be reflect by a stone is of a very different nature than that reflected in our neural activity. We shouldn't imagine that we'll experience intellectual thoughts in the stone. They key is that the inner space circumscribed by our skin and where we feel our conscious existence, is not disconnected from inner space at large. That's why a good exercise is to follow the world with our thoughts, touch it, follow its forms and movements. Then gradually we begin to sense that the inner being of the tree can reflect intuitions just like our inner brain reflects intuitions and we call that thoughts.

[AshvinP]

Guney,

It is quite impressive to me that you are not only exploring first-person spiritual activity through study and meditative efforts, but you are also courageously expressing those explorations in these posts. Those of us on a path of higher cognitive development know that 99% of what we grasp in our expanding intuitive orientation towards spiritual reality cannot make into onto the page in crystal clear concepts, so don't worry that what you express here somehow reflects negatively on your actual understanding. We will always start off with a lot of confused concepts which will gradually straighten out and find their appropriate places in the holistic tapestry as we persist, and then some amount of confusion persists but we are less frustrated or discouraged by it because we know concretely in what direction we are heading.

Is our ego equated with our mental activity, of which thinking is only the end product?
If so, how is our thinking shaped by other beings, feelings, ideas and so on.
Do these things live in our self(i) or is there a separation. Or is our ego not involved in the unfolding of thoughts


suppose we see a tree, how do we form a thinking gesture like we do with verbs?
And how does this gesture help us understand what a tree is?
For this we would first have to analyze the perception of the tree with our thinking.

I think it helps here to also distinguish between what esoteric science calls the sentient soul, intellectual soul, and consciousness soul, through which the Ego-"I" unfolds its inner activity at our current stage. These aren't arbitrary categories which were invented to sound nice, but distinctions which naturally arise through the first-person observation of the evolving inner life. Other labels could just as easily be used, like 'mind soul' instead of intellectual soul, or 'spiritual soul' instead of consciousness soul. Here is a helpful passage on that. Cleric also discussed it here. We could say what normally unfolds in the sentient soul is the instinctive pre-verbal thinking, the intellectual soul is more feeling-imbued, pictorial and fluid, the consciousness soul utilizes more rigid verbal concepts. For normal development, currently the "I" lives almost entirely in the consciousness soul. The most proximate evolutionary goal is to enliven the consciousness soul and expand its wakeful cognition back into the lower soul members as well, where more Cosmic cognitive currents flow.

However, one has to realise if one considers the human being as a whole that the human soul that enjoys life in the entire, also bodily-mental organisation is not a simple one. One can want again wholeheartedly to be trivial and say, why do you anthroposophists have the strange habit to distinguish three soul members and even many members of the human nature? You talk there about a sentient soul, an intellectual soul, and a consciousness soul. Nevertheless, it would be much easier to speak of the soul as a uniform being which has thoughts, feelings and will-impulses. -- Certainly, it is easier, more comfortable — and more trivial, too. However, this is something at the same time that cannot promote the scientific consideration of the human being really. For it is not the longing for categorising and speaking many words. The arrangement of the human soul arises in the sentient soul, which is connected with the surroundings at first and receives the perception and sensations from the outside, in which the desires and instincts develop, and which is to be separated from the part in which already in a certain sense the received is processed. We activate our sentient soul, facing the outside world, perceiving its colours and sounds, but we also let appear what we, as normal human beings, cannot control at first: our desires and passions. However, if we withdraw and process what we have taken up by the perception et cetera in ourselves, so that the things of the outside world which are animated in us transform themselves into feelings, then we live in the second soul member, in the intellectual soul. As far as we control our thoughts and are not controlled by them, we live in the consciousness soul. In the Occult Science or in the Theosophy you see that three soul members have much more relations — in other way — to the outside world, not because we like to categorise, but the sentient soul is assigned in quite different way to the universe than the consciousness soul.

The consciousness soul isolates the human being and makes him feeling as an internally closed being. The intellectual soul relates him to the surroundings and to the whole universe; thereby he is a being that appears as an essence, as a confluence of the whole world. By the consciousness soul the human being lives in himself, isolates himself. The most principal what one experiences in the consciousness soul is that what one develops as the latest of his arrangements: the ability of logical thinking that we have opinions, thoughts et cetera. This rests in the consciousness soul. Concerning these qualities, the individual essence of the human being that enters existence at birth is indeed mostly subject to isolation. This innermost essence works its way at the latest. While his cover, his bodily organisation emerges at the earliest, his real individuality emerges at the latest. Nevertheless, as the human being is in the present — he was different in the past and will be different in the future -, indeed, he develops his opinions, concepts, mental pictures in the most isolated part of his nature. Hence, these exert the least influence on the entire construction and arrangement of his personality and appear only as predispositions when the whole personality is formed plastically.

[Güney27]

Ashvin,

Thanks for your comment.


It is quite impressive to me that you not only explore first-person spiritual activity through study and meditative endeavors, but also boldly express those explorations in these posts. Those of us on a path of higher cognitive development know that 99% of what we grasp in our expanding intuitive orientation to spiritual reality cannot be put aside in crystal clear concepts, so don't worry about that what you express here somehow reflects negatively on your actual understanding. We will always start with many confused concepts that will gradually straighten out and find their proper place in the holistic tapestry as we proceed, and then some level of confusion will remain, but we will be less frustrated or discouraged because we concretely know in which direction we are going.

I have to try more to let go of the ideas I have formed about anthroposophy and concentrate more on practice. Steiner warned against letting anthroposophy become theory.
It just doesn't make sense to me to read and daydream about every angelic hierarchy. In the end, I imagine myself underneath, winged beings flying through another world. This is pure fantasy. However, I fell into this reverie when I read Steiner's writings. I don't blame him for this, but I think meditation is essential to understanding properly.
Sometimes I come to points where I am full of confusion when I study anthroposophy.
Cleric's Essay really helped me to improve my understanding as I think he writes very clearly.
I think I need to trust my development process/ideal.
It is a path to walk, transforming not at the end but at every step.



Do you have any advice on how to be more disciplined about meditating?
I keep making plans to meditate, but end up reading only about meditation.
I have a strong tendency to want to understand everything intellectually 100 percent before doing anything.
I have decided to write a plan to approach my meditation in a structured way, different exercises at different times of the day.
Would it be bad if I meditate at the same times every day?


I've been thinking about getting a tattoo for months.
Would a tattoo have an impact on my development (spiritual development).
I couldn't find anything about it from Steiner.

Kind regards

[Güney27]

Hello Cleric,

,,some external observer could see our imaginary fly it would be just as unpredictable as the real one. He would say that the imaginary fly moves erratically. But there's difference between the erratic as the person grasps it and the erratic that we experience when imagining the movement. It is this difference that the example tries to point out."


Yes, I can totally understand that.
When I do the A E I O U exercise, I try to spontaneously change the order of the vowels.
I noticed that I don't know myself why I thought I instead of E. It feels random, yet I still feel like I'm actively creating and intuition is becoming a bit opaque.
Still, it's a different and clearer feeling than hearing the vowels if someone else were saying them out loud, out of order. I think this feeling is the tenporal intuition you mean.


,,At the most basic level you can reflect on the ways other human beings shape your feelings and ideas. For example, that person who insulted you or the girl that smiled at you and you now can't stop thinking of her. Do these people shape your thoughts and feelings?

It is similar with spiritual beings. There's constant interference from spiritual activity. Give some consideration of the riverbed metaphor. The whole Cosmos is your riverbed. You body, nervous system and sense organs are only the focal point. There are also finer aspects of the riverbed - your etheric, astral, mental sheaths. With your spirit (the water) you flow through the riverbed. It shapes you but you can also shape it. Since your riverbed is the whole Cosmos, it means that the way you work upon it manifests in the experiences of other focal points. Maybe if you smile to someone their thoughts and feelings will also be shaped in some way. Things are difficult only when we try to imagine that there are parts of our existence that are completely ours. Even our thoughts are not completely ours because not a single thought can be what it is if there wasn't the whole Cosmos to support it."

But there are things that only affect my flow. My past, for example, was lived only by me and can only be shaped by it. My ego (spirit) is then the same as every other being (which an ego possesses), for only one water can flow.
This is where it gets complicated. In your deep mal essay you used an image as a metaphor. The light that is in the middle is supposed to represent the I (spiritual activity)?
I think it would be wrong to say that it is my I, my spiritual activity, but it is a spiritual activity?
When I think about it I start to despair.
Perhaps one understands these things only through deeper understanding through meditation.
I don't know it.

,,You can experiment by following the reverse path of the light. When you have a perception of the tree you can say that you experience certain specific configurations in your physical and etheric brain. But then you can begin to trace these configurations. You can move your attention from you experience in the head, through the eyes and imagine you follow the threads of light towards the tree. Then try to feel the form of the tree, touch it with your thoughts from all sides, follow the branches. It's the same you would do with your hands if you place them on the trunk and glide them towards a branch, reaching the leaves, feeling their form. Try to follow the floods of sunlight as they are absorbed by the leaves. Follow the moisture in the soil as it is sucked by the roots and moves as sap.

The goal of such exercises is not to imagine that these imaginative forms and movements are the actual reality of the tree. The goal is to go beyond ourselves and fill the environment with thoughts. Then later, as crazy it may sound, we'll see that we can think not only with the interior of our body but with the whole environment. Of course the thought that can be reflected by a stone is of a very different nature than that reflected in our neural activity. We shouldn't imagine that we'll experience intellectual thoughts in the stone. They key is that the inner space circumscribed by our skin and where we feel our conscious existence, is not disconnected from inner space at large. That's why a good exercise is to follow the world with our thoughts, touch it, follow its forms and movements. Then gradually we begin to sense that the inner being of the tree can reflect intuitions just like our inner brain reflects intuitions and we call that thoughts."


Should this exercise aim at recognizing the beings of the outer world?
If this exercise is to awaken the intuition, would it be disadvantageous if I didn't first reach the stage of imagination, inspiration?
Or should one do exercises from the beginning that train all higher levels of knowledge?


Does this exercise detach the thinking activity from the body?

[AshvinP]

Ashvin,

Thanks for your comment.


It is quite impressive to me that you not only explore first-person spiritual activity through study and meditative endeavors, but also boldly express those explorations in these posts. Those of us on a path of higher cognitive development know that 99% of what we grasp in our expanding intuitive orientation to spiritual reality cannot be put aside in crystal clear concepts, so don't worry about that what you express here somehow reflects negatively on your actual understanding. We will always start with many confused concepts that will gradually straighten out and find their proper place in the holistic tapestry as we proceed, and then some level of confusion will remain, but we will be less frustrated or discouraged because we concretely know in which direction we are going.

I have to try more to let go of the ideas I have formed about anthroposophy and concentrate more on practice. Steiner warned against letting anthroposophy become theory.
It just doesn't make sense to me to read and daydream about every angelic hierarchy. In the end, I imagine myself underneath, winged beings flying through another world. This is pure fantasy. However, I fell into this reverie when I read Steiner's writings. I don't blame him for this, but I think meditation is essential to understanding properly.
Sometimes I come to points where I am full of confusion when I study anthroposophy.
Cleric's Essay really helped me to improve my understanding as I think he writes very clearly.
I think I need to trust my development process/ideal.
It is a path to walk, transforming not at the end but at every step.

Guney,

Right, that is always a trap at first. It either leads us to reject the teaching outright or hold on to fantastical conceptions about it. You are correct, meditation will greatly help loosen the intellectual mask which continually tries to format living, rhythmic supra-sensory processes into fixed (dead) pictures and concepts. I also found Cleric's posts here greatly help to 'de-fantasize' the spiritual scientific research. The technical metaphors are really useful to keep in mind, such as those from TCT, aliasing, Cantor dust fractal, Levin's models, etc. They can help further bring seemingly arcane occult research, developed for ages through the mysteries, into a form fitting the clarity of our modern thinking consciousness. Steiner also has a good deal of books/lectures which help with this, such as those related to studying the natural sciences. It is generally good that you have recognized this tendency so early and are proactively dealing with it.

Do you have any advice on how to be more disciplined about meditating?
I keep making plans to meditate, but end up reading only about meditation.
I have a strong tendency to want to understand everything intellectually 100 percent before doing anything.
I have decided to write a plan to approach my meditation in a structured way, different exercises at different times of the day.
Would it be bad if I meditate at the same times every day?


I've been thinking about getting a tattoo for months.
Would a tattoo have an impact on my development (spiritual development).
I couldn't find anything about it from Steiner.

Kind regards

It took me a long time to bite the bullet and start meditating seriously and daily. I also procrastinated by telling myself I needed to really understand everything intellectually before proceeding to the next step. Some of that preparation is definitely good, and non-meditative spiritual study shouldn't be seen as something completely different from what we aim to do in meditation (for ex. see my comment on katharsis from reading PoF or similar material), but we also can't expect the intellect to impossibly encompass higher realities.

Your current plan is a great start, much more structured than even what I do currently. It is not at all bad to have a set rhythmic routine of exercises, in fact that is probably the most healthy way to go about it. People have started to look upon 'routine' as synonymous with boring, mechanical, etc., but we should realize human culture and its rhythms embed great Cosmic wisdom from ages past. Sure, we now have the freedom to sleep at 3am and wake up at 12pm, or to eat breakfast at lunchtime, or what have you, but that doesn't mean it's healthy. It certainly isn't healthy for spiritual development. Instead we can freely attune our body-soul-spirit organism more and more to the wise rhythms of the World, which are already embedded in culture and even our physiology, only deviating as necessary to accomplish our other tasks. We don't follow the rhythms instinctively or mechanically, but in full consciousness with an aim towards imbuing them with rejuvenated spiritual life through our universal ideals. So establishing a set routine for meditation is a good way to go about that.

The other thing often mentioned is heartfelt prayer for the wisdom and strength to fulfill our daily tasks such as meditation (or anything else we need to accomplish for our spiritual maturation). It really is the most effective tool for motivating and disciplining the unruly mind and soul.

"Be anxious for nothing, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."

By default it will feel pretty silly at first to be praying all the time, even if we already have faith or belief in a higher power. That reflects the depths to which the modern soul has descended into materialism. But if we persist with the same effort we use for our conceptual study, it will feel more and more natural over time. The subtle life body which embeds our various habits proceeds according to its own rhythm in relation to our ego and desire body, and gradually we can etch these new devotional habits into it through our spiritual activity.

[AshvinP]

Ashvin,

Thanks for your comment.


It is quite impressive to me that you not only explore first-person spiritual activity through study and meditative endeavors, but also boldly express those explorations in these posts. Those of us on a path of higher cognitive development know that 99% of what we grasp in our expanding intuitive orientation to spiritual reality cannot be put aside in crystal clear concepts, so don't worry about that what you express here somehow reflects negatively on your actual understanding. We will always start with many confused concepts that will gradually straighten out and find their proper place in the holistic tapestry as we proceed, and then some level of confusion will remain, but we will be less frustrated or discouraged because we concretely know in which direction we are going.

I have to try more to let go of the ideas I have formed about anthroposophy and concentrate more on practice. Steiner warned against letting anthroposophy become theory.
It just doesn't make sense to me to read and daydream about every angelic hierarchy. In the end, I imagine myself underneath, winged beings flying through another world. This is pure fantasy. However, I fell into this reverie when I read Steiner's writings. I don't blame him for this, but I think meditation is essential to understanding properly.
Sometimes I come to points where I am full of confusion when I study anthroposophy.
Cleric's Essay really helped me to improve my understanding as I think he writes very clearly.
I think I need to trust my development process/ideal.
It is a path to walk, transforming not at the end but at every step.

Guney,

Right, that is always a trap at first. It either leads us to reject the teaching outright or hold on to fantastical conceptions about it. You are correct, meditation will greatly help loosen the intellectual mask which continually tries to format living, rhythmic supra-sensory processes into fixed (dead) pictures and concepts. I also found Cleric's posts here greatly help to 'de-fantasize' the spiritual scientific research. The technical metaphors are really useful to keep in mind, such as those from TCT, aliasing, Cantor dust fractal, Levin's models, etc. They can help further bring seemingly arcane occult research, developed for ages through the mysteries, into a form fitting the clarity of our modern thinking consciousness. Steiner also has a good deal of books/lectures which help with this, such as those related to studying the natural sciences. It is generally good that you have recognized this tendency so early and are proactively dealing with it.

Do you have any advice on how to be more disciplined about meditating?
I keep making plans to meditate, but end up reading only about meditation.
I have a strong tendency to want to understand everything intellectually 100 percent before doing anything.
I have decided to write a plan to approach my meditation in a structured way, different exercises at different times of the day.
Would it be bad if I meditate at the same times every day?


I've been thinking about getting a tattoo for months.
Would a tattoo have an impact on my development (spiritual development).
I couldn't find anything about it from Steiner.

Kind regards

It took me a long time to bite the bullet and start meditating seriously and daily. I also procrastinated by telling myself I needed to really understand everything intellectually before proceeding to the next step. Some of that preparation is definitely good, and non-meditative spiritual study shouldn't be seen as something completely different from what we aim to do in meditation (for ex. see my comment on katharsis from reading PoF or similar material), but we also can't expect the intellect to impossibly encompass higher realities.

Your current plan is a great start, much more structured than even what I do currently. It is not at all bad to have a set rhythmic routine of exercises, in fact that is probably the most healthy way to go about it. People have started to look upon 'routine' as synonymous with boring, mechanical, etc., but we should realize human culture and its rhythms embed great Cosmic wisdom from ages past. Sure, we now have the freedom to sleep at 3am and wake up at 12pm, or to eat breakfast at lunchtime, or what have you, but that doesn't mean it's healthy. It certainly isn't healthy for spiritual development. Instead we can freely attune our body-soul-spirit organism more and more to the wise rhythms of the World, which are already embedded in culture and even our physiology, only deviating as necessary to accomplish our other tasks. We don't follow the rhythms instinctively or mechanically, but in full consciousness with an aim towards imbuing them with rejuvenated spiritual life through our universal ideals. So establishing a set routine for meditation is a good way to go about that.

The other thing often mentioned is heartfelt prayer for the wisdom and strength to fulfill our daily tasks such as meditation (or anything else we need to accomplish for our spiritual maturation). It really is the most effective tool for motivating and disciplining the unruly mind and soul.

"Be anxious for nothing, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."

By default it will feel pretty silly at first to be praying all the time, even if we already have faith or belief in a higher power. That reflects the depths to which the modern soul has descended into materialism. But if we persist with the same effort we use for our conceptual study, it will feel more and more natural over time. The subtle life body which embeds our various habits proceeds according to its own rhythm in relation to our ego and desire body, and gradually we can etch these new devotional habits into it through our spiritual activity.

I want to mention one other thing. Lately I have cultivated a real sense of how important our meditative efforts are for the spiritual evolution of humanity. Much of that sense will come through an exploration of the living details of spiritual evolution, which of course takes patience and effort. But even with our initial efforts, we can experience the oppressive influences which continuously come to meet us and frustrate or discourage us. These are real spiritual forces working in the world right now. The more we meet them in our intimate efforts, the more we can also discern them working through society as a whole. We shouldn't get too fixated on 'evil powers' or conspiracy theories, but we can also cultivate a feeling that it is a critical juncture of human evolution back towards the Spirit and the stakes are quite high. We are preparing to do battle with our inner dragons which we share with the World as a whole, as is evident these days even to our normal powers of discernment.

Contemplating passages from scripture such as follows should help.

Finally, be strong in the Lord and in His mighty power. Put on the full armor of God, so that you can make your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this world’s darkness, and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

Therefore take up the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you will be able to stand your ground, and having done everything, to stand. Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness arrayed, and with your feet fitted with the readiness of the gospel of peace. In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. And take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.

Pray in the Spirit at all times, with every kind of prayer and petition. To this end, stay alert with all perseverance in your prayers for all the saints. Pray also for me, that whenever I open my mouth, words may be given me so that I will boldly make known the mystery of the gospel, for which I am an ambassador in chains. Pray that I may proclaim it fearlessly, as I should.

I generally meditate in a closet in my bedroom. When I open the bedroom door, I imagine that I am traveling into the ancient Temple and working my way inwards through the sanctuaries. The door to the closet takes me into the main sanctuary, where there is a door guarded by two cherubim which leads into the Holy of Holies. The latter is within me - my inner volume into which I will concentrate my inverted spiritual activity to invite the spirit worlds to inflow my be-ing. I find that connecting my current practice with such grand symbols of our collective spiritual evolution helps motivate the will and enliven the understanding to meet the high stakes faced by modern humanity.

[Federica]

Ashvin, the above two cherubim don't do justice to your idea, to say the least. If I may share one of Raffello's:

[Güney27]

Ashvin,

I came across this.
If we take a mantram, for example:

Brighter than the sun Purer than the snow Finer than the ether Is the self, The spirit in my heart. I am this self
I am this self.

Should we then bring up these thoughts in a concentrated manner, as in Cleric's exercise with the vowels?
If it is only about the thinking activity, it would not be unnecessary to use such complicated sentences.
What is the purpose of such mantras?

[AshvinP]

Ashvin, the above two cherubim don't do justice to your idea, to say the least. If I may share one of Raffello's:

That's a great one, Federica, thanks!

I also wanted to experiment with the 'AI' image creator It was supposed to somewhat reflect the construction of Solomon's temple, but obviously leaves a lot to be desired.

In the inner sanctuary he made two cherubim, each ten cubits high, out of olive wood. One wing of the first cherub was five cubits long, and the other wing was five cubits long as well. So the full wingspan was ten cubits. The second cherub also measured ten cubits; both cherubim had the same size and shape, and the height of each cherub was ten cubits.

And he placed the cherubim inside the innermost room of the temple. Since their wings were spread out, the wing of the first cherub touched one wall, while the wing of the second cherub touched the other wall, and in the middle of the room their wingtips touched. He also overlaid the cherubim with gold.

Then he carved the walls all around the temple, in both the inner and outer sanctuaries, with carved engravings of cherubim, palm trees, and open flowers. And he overlaid the temple floor with gold in both the inner and outer sanctuaries.

[AshvinP]

Ashvin,

I came across this.
If we take a mantram, for example:

Brighter than the sun Purer than the snow Finer than the ether Is the self, The spirit in my heart. I am this self
I am this self.

Should we then bring up these thoughts in a concentrated manner, as in Cleric's exercise with the vowels?
If it is only about the thinking activity, it would not be unnecessary to use such complicated sentences.
What is the purpose of such mantras?

Guney,

Yes, that is actually one I use very frequently in meditation. Although my version begins, "More radiant than the Sun", and ends, "I am this Self, this Self am I."

Such mantras were carefully constructed by the Masters of Wisdom, so they can be really effective. It may seem complicated at first, but notice the archetypal sevenfold structure (among other things).

(1) More radiant than the Sun,
(2) Purer than the snow,
(3) Finer than the ether,
(4) Is the Self.
(5) The Spirit in my heart,
(6) I am this Self,
(7) this Self am I.

Our phone numbers are seven digits long because, among other reasons, that's typically what we can remember. After you work with it for a bit, it will come very naturally. It's very interesting to contemplate the sevenfold structure even exoterically.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... mber-seven

1. It has been significant since ancient times. It was prominent in many ancient cultures. Most famous of all were the seven wonders of the world which comprised a bucket list for every world traveler — the Great Pyramid of Giza, the Hanging Gardens of Babylon, the Temple of Artemis at Ephesus, the Statue of Zeus at Olympia, the Mausoleum at Halicarnassus, the Colossus of Rhodes, and the Lighthouse of Alexandria.

2. It has had significance in almost every major religion. In the Old Testament the world was created in six days and God rested on the seventh, creating the basis of the seven-day-week we use to this day. In the New Testament the number seven symbolizes the unity of the four corners of the Earth with the Holy Trinity. The number seven is also featured in the Book of Revelation (seven churches, seven angels, seven seals, seven trumpets, and seven stars). The Koran speaks of seven heavens and Muslim pilgrims walk around the Kaaba in Mecca (Islam’s most sacred site) seven times. In Hinduism there are seven higher worlds and seven underworlds, and in Buddhism the newborn Buddha rises and takes seven steps.

3. It is associated with luck and magical properties. Seven not only represents the jackpot on slot machines, but it s also the basis for many myths and folklore. For example, various parts of the world had beliefs about the seventh son of a seventh son, legends that endowed him with magical powers of both the good and evil variety (e.g., the child was believed to have healing powers according to Irish folklore).

4. It matches our memory capacity. In 1956, George Miller of Harvard University wrote what is today considered one of the classic papers in psychology in which he demonstrated that most people can retain roughly seven items of information in their short-term memory. That is why phone numbers in the U.S. and many other countries tend to have seven digits (area code not withstanding) — as it is the most digits most people are likely to recall (although cell phones have done away with the need to recall anyone's phone number, even our own).

5. It fits our attention spans. Because of our mental capacity favoring seven items, seven is also a good fit for our attentions spans, as long as the information is presented in seven groups. While bloggers and authors tend to take advantage of this fact, some seem to take more advantage the others. For example, the book: 7 Pages to Success: The Ultimate Short-Attention-Span Guide to Unlock Your Full Potential! is only 7 pages long, which is fine, but it costs $7 (!), which leads me to believe the only real potential being unlocked is that of the author’s bank account.

6. It is a prime number. Prime numbers are those that can only be divided by themselves and by the number 1, and have long been considered special to mathematicians and non-mathematicians alike. Seven is considered by some to be the most ‘prime’ number within the first 10 numbers as you cannot multiply it within the group, making it a kind of optimal-prime (not to be confused with Optimus Prime, who is a Transformer).

7. It is the most popular number. The mathematician Alex Bellos asked 44,000 people to name their favorite number and over 4,000 of them named the number 7, far more than any other number. Indeed, ask people to name a number from one to ten and many will name the number seven — as many magicians know.

Of course we shouldn't try to intellectually analyze the meaning of the verses, especially while we are meditating. We should treat them as any other thought-image into which we concentrate, with devotion, and let their content expand into and fill our inner volume. Sometimes I try to accompany the first two verses with pictures, because I feel it helps ward off distractions, but that's not necessary. We should trust that such mantras cordially invite the Cosmic will into our concentrated spiritual activity, to reanimate it with new life.