Güney27 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 10:41 pm
Federica wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 9:29 pm
Güney,
Jung and Steiner were not friends. Jung wrote in 1935, that there was nothing of the slightest use for him in Steiner's work, see
this post. Steiner called Jung's (early) psycho analytical works "dilettantism squared", see the lecture quoted
here.
I don't agree with the statement in the video that one can only understand Steiner if one first understands Jung. The subsequent statements are also not accurate. I listened to the first 10 minutes, and these sound like a wishy-washy account of the soul-spiritual world according to RS and CGJ. In French and Italian one would say: a rosewater account.
Federica,
The title is not to be taken literally.
Steiner never really knew Jung's mystical side because it only came to light later. Steiner could not have known a large part of Jung's work.
In my opinion, the meaning of his somewhat polemical statement is that Steiner was far ahead of his time and that we can better absorb many of his messages if we have taken the step of individuation.
Jung is therefore suitable as an introduction to the inner dimension of man and makes one more open to further, deeper esoteric topics.
However, we can better understand Jung and his methods through Steiner's work.
He talks about imaginations, which you can better classify and understand if you know Steiner.
Jung gives us a way to realize our higher self through the process of individuation, isn't that the goal that must be pursued?
Would you agree that there are different paths and levels of initiation?
There are many other videos on this channel that are interesting.
Güney,
I get that the title means that, to progress on the path, we can constructively build on both RS's and CGJ's work, since they complement each other well. But I don't really agree with that.
Had you mentioned Barfield I would have agreed, but I don't think one can find guidance on a path of initiation by
reading Jung in any way similar to the guidance one receives when reading Steiner. One could get lost in Jung's "
introduction to the inner dimension of man" for one's whole life...
When it comes to taking the step of individuation, maybe it's possible, after years of psycho-analytical sessions, I don't know, however I really doubt one can take the step of individuation by reading Jung's books. Based on my incomplete knowledge, they report experiences, theories, and methodologies, but they don't directly stimulate the birth of the self within the reader, they don't help him awake to his first person thinking perspective of reality. One can sit down and ponder the views and considerations with one's mind tweezers forever, and entirely miss the necessity of a willed soul-spiritual transformation.
I do think that Jungian psycho-analysis can help one become more aware of one's soul constitution, but in a mediated, rationalized way, that doesn't replace the real, direct encounter with the impulses that animate our soul life, like one can have as a student of Anthroposophy. Moreover I don't think that "
Jung gives us a way to realize our higher self through the process of individuation". What do you mean by that exactly? One thing is the soul, another thing is the higher self.
I do agree that there are different paths and levels of development and initiation, of course.